slick379
  •  slick379
  • 51.5% (Neutral)
  • Foreman Topic Starter
Saturday, February 8, 2014 10:10:40 PM
I have seen a few old chance rides for sale was wondering how hard is a sky diver and twister to set up and tear down
ridejocky
Saturday, February 8, 2014 11:20:46 PM
Never moved a twister, but the diver is not bad if you have four guys.

4 hours up and 2 down with a decent crew.
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johnroach100
Saturday, February 8, 2014 11:34:20 PM
I know a guy who helped set up a twister once. He said it was like setting up a trabant and a tilt at the same time, only on the side of a hill.
ridejocky
Saturday, February 8, 2014 11:37:51 PM
Problem with the diver is it is on two trailers and is slow loading.
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slick379
  •  slick379
  • 51.5% (Neutral)
  • Foreman Topic Starter
Sunday, February 9, 2014 1:16:25 AM
They seem like ok rides nice height on diver and different on twister . don't see to many twisters out there.

carnivalguy135
Sunday, February 9, 2014 3:48:20 PM
when i was out on the PGAM midway over the summer in 2013 i asked eddie 1 of the owners how long to setup there Diver he said roughly 10 hour's with 4 mexican's.
SideWinder
Sunday, February 9, 2014 5:52:00 PM
Originally Posted by: carnivalguy135 

when i was out on the PGAM midway over the summer in 2013 i asked eddie 1 of the owners how long to setup there Diver he said roughly 10 hour's with 4 mexican's.



Of course he was pulling your leg dude....
carnivalguy135
Sunday, February 9, 2014 6:54:47 PM
Kinda figured because he chuckled a little after he said it.[agree]
squirrel
Friday, February 14, 2014 9:42:44 PM
Older Chance iron that has been sitting for long periods of time needs to be gone over very carefully looking for metal fatigue and rust in hidden places. They are very well designed rides, but in some circumstances, the long support steel tubes and such will be 'racked' in ways that permit water to collect over time and continually erode the steel from the inside out. Always helps to take an old chipping hammer or slag hammer and tap away around joints and such where 'boxes' are made at the end of longer supports without drain holes. IF the owner is serious about the sale, he will understand why you do it. And if you don't know what a chipping hammer is, you don't belong anywhere near a carnival ride made of steel that you are responsible for. End of story.


Prime example is rear tower supports for a Zipper (the two 'broken leg' supports). Racked, water can collect from the rear of the ride and settle into those tubes. Over time, they erode from the inside out. I've had to replace them several times on older units (only once per), but it never hurts to check...

I'll post some pictures when I have time.

PS: This condition can exist on ANY ride of ANY age that has not been monitored especially when left stored for periods of time undisturbed. That's when the steel suffers it's most damage - When they're in the air, it's usually for a short period, and any long-term damage from 'collecting water' and drying/repeat is not near as common... But if it's a park ride, then the same applies.
WestCoastPat
Saturday, February 15, 2014 3:25:40 PM
Thanks SS for your insight. You bring a "way to look" at things around here that is different and needed. Many years ago I owned and used a chipping hammer-and all the other stuff a person would need to own and operate a piece of steel. Don't have it anymore and am glad of that. But you keep us grounded when our "What if's" get out of whack with the real world.

Post all the pictures you can-I look forward to your posts and insight. WCP
WestCoastPat-Proud Mark of all things Carnival. STILL a "FAN BOY"-and proud of it.
squirrel
Saturday, February 15, 2014 5:30:02 PM
Originally Posted by: WestCoastPat 

Thanks SS for your insight. You bring a "way to look" at things around here that is different and needed. Many years ago I owned and used a chipping hammer-and all the other stuff a person would need to own and operate a piece of steel. Don't have it anymore and am glad of that. But you keep us grounded when our "What if's" get out of whack with the real world.

Post all the pictures you can-I look forward to your posts and insight. WCP



It'll be a couple days on the pictures -- I have another post that's awaiting pictures as well :)

Appreciate the thanks, WCP -- I don't post here near as much as in the past, and to be honest, I know my posts have become much more 'blunt' with regards to my opinion.

The reality of that situation is that over the last few years, I've become less blinded by this industry as a whole and am really starting to see many of the inside-issues that I feel are beyond important - whether they're my opinion based on experience, or flat-out fact. And it is becoming increasingly clear that there are many out there who are operating or are responsible for equipment operation, and they have NO FRIGGIN BUSINESS being responsible for lives on the iron. On top of that, the insurance companies who cover these people with every loophole known to man to protect themselves, while taking the money for a policy they KNOW they will never pay on, are just as guilty. I have spent over 20 years (closer to 25) working, learning, observing, and even participating in this industry.

I've seen some * in my times that would drive a drunk man sober and clean up the worst junkie with fear... Yet the ones who were responsible for those things never saw it as an issue, and continued on until people got hurt. It has not changed, and regardless of how many real-world facts and realities I see and document, I doubt it ever will.

Have a good one, my friend!
ridejocky
Sunday, February 16, 2014 8:50:32 AM
Diver A-frames are notorious for rusting out....

One nice thing about Chance rides is that (I think) all that square tubing is standard and if it does rust out, it is relatively cheap and easy to replace.

OSPHO is a Chance ride's best friend!
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flamo
  •  flamo
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  • Operations Foreman
Sunday, February 16, 2014 9:59:18 PM
There is another ugly factor that will soon rear its ugly head. Before computers designers generally over built iron. Today rides are computer designed with formulas that give exact stands as to stress and torque with the iron sized to it. The newer rides with age and use diminish what the iron can handle. Internal rust and fatigue and up fast. Those responsible for the safety of patrons have to learn where to look and how to look for for things like distortion or hair cracks. Paint often covers these defects. Overlaying a cracked weld isn't the answer. A proper repair would include grinding the old weld out to good parent metal, sometimes including preheating then welding with a proper welding rod. There are ways to find defects such as ultra sound or xray but it is expensive.
Eli Bridge for 100 years built spokes and towers from components, mainly angle iron and flat bar. Now it is tubing. Will the new wheels last 50 to 75 years even with s good maint program?
I'm there, Old, Tired, Broke and Henpecked
squirrel
Sunday, February 16, 2014 11:53:37 PM
Originally Posted by: flamo 

There is another ugly factor that will soon rear its ugly head. Before computers designers generally over built iron. Today rides are computer designed with formulas that give exact stands as to stress and torque with the iron sized to it.

The newer rides with age and use diminish what the iron can handle. Internal rust and fatigue and up fast. Those responsible for the safety of patrons have to learn where to look and how to look for for things like distortion or hair cracks. Paint often covers these defects. Overlaying a cracked weld isn't the answer.

A proper repair would include grinding the old weld out to good parent metal, sometimes including preheating then welding with a proper welding rod. There are ways to find defects such as ultra sound or xray but it is expensive.

Eli Bridge for 100 years built spokes and towers from components, mainly angle iron and flat bar. Now it is tubing. Will the new wheels last 50 to 75 years even with s good maint program?



I don't expect them to last. Once you box something in, you create a way for water to get inside (or condensate inside - the bigger enemy) and not get back out. This creates fatigue and damage where you cannot see it. It's one of the reasons I won't EVER own a used Gravitron. The design of fiberglass around steel leaves too much 'unseen' without destructive testing to verify the condition of the underlying/load-bearing steel. If it came from the factory new, then yes -- otherwise - not a chance in hell.


ridejocky
Monday, February 17, 2014 8:11:03 AM
Originally Posted by: secret.squirrel 

I don't expect them to last. Once you box something in, you create a way for water to get inside (or condensate inside - the bigger enemy) and not get back out. This creates fatigue and damage where you cannot see it. It's one of the reasons I won't EVER own a used Gravitron. The design of fiberglass around steel leaves too much 'unseen' without destructive testing to verify the condition of the underlying/load-bearing steel. If it came from the factory new, then yes -- otherwise - not a chance in hell.




while I generally agree, paint and paint systems are much better than they've ever been. I think I don't know about now, but in the 70's Chance really cheaped out on paint.

Nothing wrong with tubing, as long as it drains. It also looks better and lets you run wire for lights and what not.

I'm surprised you don't see more shows using hot-dip galvanized on a lot of stuff.
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